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Mixdown, Dynamics & EQ (and related) Topic

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Postby Soundphase » 01 Sep 2016, 17:09

CAP:
Soundphase:hope someone knows the answer to this
- with an unmastered track, at what db volume should the hardstyle kick be playing at for an acceptable loudness and for ultimately a good mix?

with a hardstyle or hardcore kick I'm unsure of the link between too quiet and too loud since the mids in the kick can be quite harsh if played too loud in headphones


the mix is the audio version of the theory of relativity. how loud should the kick be? that doesn't really matter as long as it's loud enough to overcome the volume related bit depth reduction of your DAW and anything over -20dB should be more than fine. even then the whole bit depth reduction might be more related to older DAWs than to today. to digress back to the relativity stuff, the volume of the kick doesn't really matter....what matters is it's relative volume and tonality against your other instruments. typically though, mine seem to sit around -12dB and can bump up to -8dB some times

tldr: as long as you make a well balanced mix, it doesn't matter how loud the kick is

I see, thanks guys. overthinking on my part then I guess, finding it comfortable to work with a kick level of -5 to -10db just because I don't have to go adjusting the volume knob on the audio interface all the time.
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Postby CAP » 01 Sep 2016, 18:42

Soundphase:
CAP:
Soundphase:hope someone knows the answer to this
- with an unmastered track, at what db volume should the hardstyle kick be playing at for an acceptable loudness and for ultimately a good mix?

with a hardstyle or hardcore kick I'm unsure of the link between too quiet and too loud since the mids in the kick can be quite harsh if played too loud in headphones


the mix is the audio version of the theory of relativity. how loud should the kick be? that doesn't really matter as long as it's loud enough to overcome the volume related bit depth reduction of your DAW and anything over -20dB should be more than fine. even then the whole bit depth reduction might be more related to older DAWs than to today. to digress back to the relativity stuff, the volume of the kick doesn't really matter....what matters is it's relative volume and tonality against your other instruments. typically though, mine seem to sit around -12dB and can bump up to -8dB some times

tldr: as long as you make a well balanced mix, it doesn't matter how loud the kick is

I see, thanks guys. overthinking on my part then I guess, finding it comfortable to work with a kick level of -5 to -10db just because I don't have to go adjusting the volume knob on the audio interface all the time.


depending on your DAW, you might be able to have monitor control in your DAW. for example i use Cubase and there's what they call the "control room" panel that fits on the mix window. this allows me to control level as well as monitor selection and flip the mix from stereo to mono easily. There's also a spot for a couple inserts so I have analyzers and a brickwall to protect my monitors. this allows signal to come out of my interface at full volume and i don't have to reach over all the time
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Postby Meltdown » 03 Feb 2017, 20:16

Basicely main of the mastering are made with an -6DB max peak track ;) for exemple me when i send my track to the engineer is everytimes -60DB max peak track and wav 24 bit 44.100hz is not for have better sound or loudness etc... is simply for have headroom for the mastering ;)

mastering is not magical process never except a better mix-down with mastering cause is not possible ^^ but if the mix-down are realy clean with a nice ratio Loud/Clean the mastering will be powerfull that's it ;)

Sometimes a mastering can gluing a bit better all element but you get kinds of sweeping frequency when is boosted to the max
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Postby TJOAudio » 05 Feb 2017, 14:04

Meltdown:Basicely main of the mastering are made with an -6DB max peak track ;) for exemple me when i send my track to the engineer is everytimes -60DB max peak track and wav 24 bit 44.100hz is not for have better sound or loudness etc... is simply for have headroom for the mastering ;)

mastering is not magical process never except a better mix-down with mastering cause is not possible ^^ but if the mix-down are realy clean with a nice ratio Loud/Clean the mastering will be powerfull that's it ;)

Sometimes a mastering can gluing a bit better all element but you get kinds of sweeping frequency when is boosted to the max


That -6dbfs meme is not right. You don't need to make your tracks -6db, especially with 32 bit float wav's, they're almost impossible to clip. It's more about the RMS and DR meaning how limited/compressed you send it off.
You can change EQ curves, but you can't really undo compression/limiting, that's the headroom you should leave. No, that doesn't mean you can't have buss compression, just don't make it destructive, or just send 2 versions, one on, other one off.

One reason people ask for -6 or even lower, is so that the end product sounds A LOT louder, therefor better, Im sure majority of people don't level match to compare.

*tldr: As long as your track is under 0dbsf, you like how it sounds and is not over-limited/compressed, you don't need to change anything to send off to mastering.

Hope this clears up some confusion, feel free to ask any other questions.
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Postby CAP » 06 Feb 2017, 18:46

while the -6dBFS may or may not be right due to 32 bit float, every mastering house i've seen requests -6dBFS.....and I don't think that it's just due to coming back with a louder product - but that wouldn't surprise me lol

- i would say it's more of a safety issue. let's say that a certain percentage of your clients doesn't even know what 32 bit floating point is or does and they export at 16bit 44.1 cuz hey, you know, it's cd quality. or maybe 24 bit, 88.2. those transients and intersample peaks when the mix sits up at -3dBFS will cause distortion. it seems that setting a mix peak at -6dBFS is just safe to ensure a good product in to make a good product out
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Postby D_Pina » 13 Apr 2017, 09:02

I have got one question.
When producers finished a track with a proper mixdown in the afternoon and want to test it at a gig the evening, how they do without a mastering ?
I mean, yes mastering a track should be done by a professional so ?
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Postby Soundphase » 17 Apr 2017, 11:39

D_Pina:I have got one question.
When producers finished a track with a proper mixdown in the afternoon and want to test it at a gig the evening, how they do without a mastering ?
I mean, yes mastering a track should be done by a professional so ?

there are guides out there on how to master your track quickly for YouTube or playing at events. While that may not be the permanent master, it does the job for those purposes
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Postby adamross » 17 Apr 2017, 13:14

A good well-balanced mix is far more important, mastering is mostly subtle eq-ing(referencing), a bit of compressing, and loudness :)

For eg: When somebody wants to play a track produced by me in a few hours, i just reference a pro track, fixing some slight 1-2 db eq problems(90% of the time it's a bit more clarity in the highs, punchiness in the bass or some noisefixing in the highmidrange) and pass a FF Pro-L to it. Most of the time my mixes are compressed enough i don't need much, only for final masters.
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Postby D_Pina » 09 May 2017, 11:19

Thanks for the replies. :)
It's more clear.
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